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Old 2nd December 2008, 06:00 PM   #1
LightWizard
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Default Need help creating texture maps

I'm a newbie trying to create Sculpties for Second Life. I created a couple of objects and I'm having trouble with texture maps (at least I think this is where my issue lies).

I posted a question on this on the general discussion...it has more detail on the issues I had. But, seeing the threads here in this forum, this looks to be the better place to ask for help...I'll try to describe it more succinctly as well.

I made a goblet by rotating it's edge shape by 360 degrees. It's a fully closed surface, with the outside of the goblet wrapping around the rim and then down into the inside...and it has a closed bottom, so there should be no gaps in its surfaces.

I also took a sphere and manipulated it to be flattened with a concave bown in the inside (trying to make a rock pool).

Both look terrible when I bring them into 2nd life. For the cup, actually creating the texture map with the cylindrical stitching works pretty well, but the inside gets no texture and shows in Second Life as transparent. Spherical texture maps don't work well, stem gets cut off, no bottom, etc.

For the pool, the only one that even vaguely seemed to work was the original spherical mapping that came from the original sphere...any attempts to modifify it with creating a new map resulted in a mess. For the original spherical map, I got the dreaded gap which I found in another post is due to the odd choice of max numbers of surfaces/vertexes chosen for 2nd life...will try later to fix that if I learn how to use the TCE.

I have some questions and hope someone can steer me in the right direction for info on how to deal with shapes that may be irregular, hollow but need a map on the inside, etc. There are a lot of postings here in the tutorials forum, but so far haven't found what I need.

Also, a few other questions if someone can answer them...all are in the context of making a sculpty for Second Life:

1) Does it matter how many vertices you have in the AC3D model? I assume/hope that the export will adjust/interpolate to a coordinate system for SL and therefore, I would hope that it would be tolerant of the number of vertices/surfaces in the original AC3D model. My cup is likely OVER the max number of SL vertices but haven't truly verified that. The pool is very likely less as it has few surfaces.

2) Do I need to split my objects into 2 meshes so I can texture map each or can I make a one size fits all map. Topologically, this should be doable with a single texture map, but maybe not in the software? If so, how (the concave parts don't seem to get mapped). Is there a tutorial on making multiple wire frames, creating texture maps, and importing those into SL? If so, please direct me...thanks.

3) Are there shape/surface morphologies I should avoid to get good mapping?

4) In my failed attempts, it appears that the texture map is referencing a point or points outside my object, making weird spiky triangles that stick way out of the object...what makes these and how do I avoid them?

5) In TCE, what size texture map should I use for SL? 512 by 512 to get rid of the dreaded gap in my object? Another size? I've been using 256x256, also tried a smaller one just in case, 64x64. 256x256 worked better.

6) Is there a max recommended number of vertices and surfaces for a 3D object for Second Life in AC3D? Any limits I should stay under to make all this work? I saw some info on what SL will take, but no info on what I can use inside AC3D (assuming the export interpolates back down to the max's for SL). If the export doesn't do this, what are the hard limits I should use for my AC3D models?

If all this is covered in one or more tutorials, can someone help me by directing me there?

Any help much appreciated...thanks...I've seen some wonderful work here done for SL, so I know it can work, but I am stumped on how to make it look as good as the other examples I've seen here.

Thanks....LW
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Old 4th December 2008, 02:55 AM   #2
LightWizard
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Default Re: Need help creating texture maps

OK, I found Lisa's texture map creation tutorial videos. I ended up with a texture for the front, back and top so it would get the concave surfaces. It looks good in TCE with 3 separate textures fitted into the box. I kept the areas of the texture the same size thinking that would more closely match the sizes of the shape boundaries. However, when I export it as an SL Normalized Sculpty, and apply the sculpty texture, it still looks like a mess.

I also made the texture area 64x64 which is the size a larger (512x512) ended up in 2nd life, thinking matching the size would help.

Note that should it matter, I didn't apply a texture in AC3D, thinking I'd use the stone texture I have in SL.

So, what am I missing in terms of making this rezz into a nice sculpty?

Thanks in advance...LW
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Old 4th December 2008, 10:13 AM   #3
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Default Re: Need help creating texture maps

Here's the last texture map I used. It is now concave, but with lots of jaggies and ill defined walls:
http://cid-1d45c78a963a46f1.skydrive...g.tga?ccr=6247

Here's the AC3D Project File:
http://cid-1d45c78a963a46f1.skydrive...Public/Pool.ac

My web server at home is down (disk issues). If you click on the above links, it will take you to a page where you can download the 2 files and take a peek. Click the file icon on that page.

I'll add the image of the sculpty in SL (it's messy) when I get a moment...in a rush now for work.

Thanks...LW
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Old 12th December 2008, 08:24 PM   #4
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Default Re: Need help creating texture maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by LightWizard View Post
1) Does it matter how many vertices you have in the AC3D model? I assume/hope that the export will adjust/interpolate to a coordinate system for SL and therefore, I would hope that it would be tolerant of the number of vertices/surfaces in the original AC3D model. My cup is likely OVER the max number of SL vertices but haven't truly verified that. The pool is very likely less as it has few surfaces.
No. You can use as many vertices as you need, and the exporter will re-sample the model to make it work with SL. AC3D doesn't have any specific hard-limits to how many vertices you can use.

Naturally however, if your model is too high-poly you may have details that are beyond the resolution of what will show up in SL. SL effectively handles a max of 1024 vertices.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LightWizard View Post
2) Do I need to split my objects into 2 meshes so I can texture map each or can I make a one size fits all map. Topologically, this should be doable with a single texture map, but maybe not in the software? If so, how (the concave parts don't seem to get mapped). Is there a tutorial on making multiple wire frames, creating texture maps, and importing those into SL? If so, please direct me...thanks.
If you have multiple objects within a single model file in AC3D--presuming each object is named differently--the exporter will export one sculpt map per object.

Whether or not you can pack multiple objects onto the same map depends. In short, the map needs to be contiguous. No holes, no gaps, one smooth uninterrupted surface. There are a few tricks you can use to pack multiples onto the same map.

A couple of different tutorials that might be helpful:

http://www.inivis.com/forum/showthread.php?p=23346

http://www.independentdeveloper.com/...rom_existing_3

http://www.independentdeveloper.com/...-from-one-prim

If you have a concave shape, you'll need to use the TCE to stitch the parts of the map together, as there's no projection that will do it all in one shot. i.e. Texture the inside, then texture the outside, then connect them into one smooth map inside the TCE. If you're new to the TCE, there are some tutorial videos floating around the forums and I think in the "resources" section of the AC3D website.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LightWizard View Post
3) Are there shape/surface morphologies I should avoid to get good mapping?
Very sharp edges \ corners are sometimes difficult. There's a few forum threads around on how to address them, but smooth shapes are generally easier to do.


Quote:
Originally Posted by LightWizard View Post
4) In my failed attempts, it appears that the texture map is referencing a point or points outside my object, making weird spiky triangles that stick way out of the object...what makes these and how do I avoid them?
Check your UV map. Usually if you're getting spikes, it means there's a hole in the map.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LightWizard View Post
5) In TCE, what size texture map should I use for SL? 512 by 512 to get rid of the dreaded gap in my object? Another size? I've been using 256x256, also tried a smaller one just in case, 64x64. 256x256 worked better.
Linden Labs strongly recommends 64x64.

Describe the gap you're seeing... ? Or more to the point, are there any black areas in the output texture map?

If there's a black spot in the texture, your gap is coming from a problem with your UV map and you need to fix your model.

However, if the texture looks correct and *only* if the gap is along the edge of a planar-mapped sculpty, there does seem to be a bug in the SL client that has to do with the number of vertices per scanline; upsampling to 128x128 will get rid of edge gap. There's not really a reason to upscale beyond that, however.
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Old 12th December 2008, 08:29 PM   #5
lisa
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Default Re: Need help creating texture maps

Just saw your other thread... I understand better what you're trying to do now...

For concave shapes, the easiest thing to do is map it *before* you make it concave.
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Old 1st August 2010, 11:24 PM   #6
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Default Re: Need help creating texture maps

Quote:
Originally Posted by lisa View Post
Check your UV map. Usually if you're getting spikes, it means there's a hole in the map.

Describe the gap you're seeing... ? Or more to the point, are there any black areas in the output texture map?

If there's a black spot in the texture, your gap is coming from a problem with your UV map and you need to fix your model.

i'm about ready to throw this program out... can someone tell me how do fix the damn uv maps on export... they always come out with black triangles along the top and bottom... i dont care if im necroposting i didnt bother to check

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